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Mormons - When Shall We Defend? Mormon Publicty - Page 5

Excellent post and I agree with you. Defending the truth should be to save the soul from falling away rather than arguing a point that will never bring peace. By the way, on this board we do not allow Antis here so you will find it easier to express your view without having to defend the truth.

Offtopic but, Please update your profile and look forward to other replies from you on various topics here.

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I so agree with your viewpoint -- you can't argue somebody into a different opinion, and the Truth is something everyone has to find for themselves. So much of what we know isn't from the written word on paper, but what is written on our hearts by the Spirit of God. Those that want "proof" of that... well, there just isn't any way to do it, and certainly not in an attitude of contention.

But it sure is difficult not to get steamed when I feel the Church or the Gospel are being attacked or denigrated. I would so love to be able to convince others that they are wrong about those things, but ... as you said, it only brings anxiety over something that can't be changed.


IMO
Roz

Mormons - When Shall We Defend? Mormon Publicty Studies Doctrine Mormon

"Why do the Elders of the Church hold their peace, instead of contradicting the various falsehoods, which are published concerning them and their principles? The answer is, it would require a standing army of writers and printers in constant employ; for no sooner are our enemies detected in one falsehood, than a thousand more are put in circulation by them: and there are many who love a lie so much more than the truth, that we are quite willing they should enjoy their strong delusion." (Parley P. Pratt, Mormonism Unveiled, 1838)

https://www.lightplanet.com/response/index.shtml

Page 5 Publicty Mormon Defend We When Mormons

With the growing popularity of the Internet, which provides instant access to all kinds of information, I think we are going to see a growing number of people leave the church. There is so much out there that you can read that is damaging to the church. The problem is, much of it is valid. When I say valid, I don't mean the anti's are right, but there is a lot out there about our history that was not taught in Sunday School and Seminary because it was not faith building. Much of that has been discussed here in various threads such as:

1. Joseph Smith marrying women already married to other men
2. DNA evidence showing the American Indians to be of Asian origin and not Middle Eastern as the B of M states.
3.The Book of Abraham not even close to the real interpretation of the papyri.
4.Mark Hoffman fooling the Prophet

These are just a few, but if we were to successfully answer all of these, there would be an endless list of others. I used to be a regular poster on an anti mormon site. My purpose for going there was not to attack or reconvert them but to understand their point of view. They are mostly former active members, return missionaries, endowed members, some former Bishops and high councelors and even a mission president. They have one thing in common....they all came to the conclusion the church is a big scam, a lie from the start. So I asked myself, why did so many lose their testimony?

The answer in part is Satan is clever. He has had thousands of years to plan his attack and we should recognize he will be very convincing. It shouldn't surprise us that this is happening, it has been predicted from the beginning. Prophets have warned us of his treachery. We have been forwarned that the last days will be difficult. Prophets continually preach to us to study the scriptures daily, have family prayer and fhe. Those who are not continually feeding on these things will be subject to the Devil.

So, you began to feel comfortable in your circumstances. You have been a Bishop and have served the Lord. You can take a break now, you have more free time, you don't need to always be studying the Gospel, time to go out and get a better income and buy a bigger house and enjoy life. I'll still go to church but I won't have to give so much of my time. Soon, you start focusing on your career and gaining an advantage in the world. Boy, it would be nice if I didnt have to fork over 10 percent of my income. Just think of what I could buy. I could save it and invest it. But no, it is a commandment and I will be blessed.

So you stay active but began to resent the amount of time the church takes away from your worldly pursuits. Boy, I slave away all week and then have to spend all day Sunday in church and now I have a new calling and have a meeting during the week too. My situation is unique. I am unable to devote as much time as I used to so I will quit my current calling so I can get caught up. What? another temple night? It's not enough you take away Sundays but this is too much. I'm geting tired of having the church tell me what to do. What movies I can see, what I can drink in my own home, even down to what underwear I can wear.

Then you come across some statements that show the American Indians cannot possibly be descended from the Lamanites. Science has proven otherwise. And look at the disgusting things Joseph did. How could a prophet do this? No wonder all those early church leaders left. They saw him for what he really was. I've been scammed all my life. This church has taken all my money, time and freedom. How could I have ever believed this crap.

So, the devil leads you carefully down to hell. It is a gradual process and none of us are exempt. Focus on the scriptures and following the councel of the prophet so you will not be led astray.

As far as how do we deal with all the anti's? They are convinced they are right so it will do no good to try and convince them they are wrong. But we shouldn't fight with them. Try to be pleasant and respectful of their position. That will work much better than contention.

Publicty Mormon Defend We When Mormons

Good post Gaucho!

The devil is clever.

If there was no way for us to find truth, and know of its goodness, we would be lost indeed. But we see there are two elements here: its truthfulness and its goodness. The former, it would seem, commands the assent of the mind - the latter the heart.

This being so, it seems we become susceptible to deception when we flag in one of those elements (or both). I do not subscribe to the view that we can be saved without mental conversion, and certainly we cannot without the conversion of our hearts.

Ultimately, that some people accept the truth and others not is not a matter of chance or circumstance. Our hearts and minds do possess the capacity to succeed; those who are weak can become strong. Our greatest enemy can become our best friend!

Now, here is a BYU talk that has some real gems in it, relating to our minds: (pdf format)
https://speeches.byu.edu/freefiles/provider...e1/WelchF03.pdf

I'd encourage all to read it - I think it is one of those talks that changes perceptions for the better.

Dubhdara.

Mormons - When Shall We Defend? Mormon Publicty

"We must stand firm. We must hold back the world. If we do so, the Almighty
will be our strength and our protector, our guide and our revelator. We
shall have the comfort of knowing that we are doing what He would have us
do. Others may not agree with us, but I am confident that they will respect
us. We will not be left alone. There are many not of our faith but who feel
as we do. They will support us. They will sustain us in our efforts. We
cannot be arrogant. We cannot be self-righteous. The very situation in
which the Lord has placed us requires that we be humble as the
beneficiaries of His direction. While we cannot agree with others on
certain matters, we must never be disagreeable. We must be friendly,
soft-spoken, neighborly, and understanding."

(Gordon B. Hinckley, "An Ensign to the Nations, a Light to the World," Ensign, Nov. 2003, 83)

Mormons When We Defend Mormon Publicty - Page 5

I was just reading through some of your old threads. Good stuff. You seam to be a lot wiser in these areas than I am. I appreciate you writing them down. About 2 years ago I would have laughed at you. I always believed in the mormon faith, but I am just starting to learn more about it. I can remember even as a kid relating more to the danites. I am not a return missionary, but my older brother is. He was a high baptizer. Good missionary in Utah. He fell away after his mission. Very soon after. He davled in some dark subjects. He is 31 now and just got back from Iraq as a 1st LT. He continues to get drunk and spout some of the worst things you will ever hear about the mormon church. His hatred for it and everyone in it is so deep that it is scary. He would go to the extreme of killing mormons if the government told him to. That is what he said. Now with me trying to get back in and his constant presents is not difficult, but aggravating. I don't bring any thing up. He is staying in my place, because nobody can stand him now. Over the corse of 10 years he went from a carismatic easy going person to what he is now. His hatred runs so deep that he cant help himself. I want to kick him out, but he is still my brother. He is decent enough when he is not drinking. He just feels something when he is around the church doctrine and then he goes in for the attack. I tried ignoring it. But he is just driven by something. He wants to take it away. Misery loves company I guess. It is like being around the Devil himself. Now what makes it even worse is that he has always been abnormally strong. And he moves really quick. Now that is scary. So I am sure you will scold me a little for what I will say next. He was feeling good one night about 2 in the morning. He woke me up saying some really bad things. I listened and waited till he got even more drunk and almost couldn't stand. He went everywhere from peon to the leadership of the church. I went in grabbed my 9 and bashed him over the head. Put the barrel against his head and told him if he didn't keep his mouth shut and leave me alone I would put a bullet in his head. He seemed to understand that. But we are talking about brothers here. The closest relationship I have ever had with anyone. Brothers willing to kill eachother over religious belief. Maybe you don't understand. People hate us. They want to kill us. They want to torture us. I don't fully get it. They just keep going. Have you read some of the anti-mormon stuff. The worst ones were former mormons. I might be wrong but I don't fully believe in turning the other cheek. People are mad about our history. It is pligomy. so and so could have had an affair and he was a leader. Who cares. that is their problem and they are dead now. Do you hear mormons getting mad about what everyone did to them. You know they were driven out of navhou. They were murdered. Women and children were raped. The government sent the military after them. If they do talk about it you don't get that since of hatred. Let me take that back most people are open minded and tolerant. At least for now. But the people that hate us really hate us. Some times you just got to bash them in the head. And myabe even put a bullet in their head. That is if your life is in danger. He stopped drinking for now. But he has got that look. You know?

Mormons When We Defend Mormon Publicty Mormon Doctrine Studies - Page 5

I hear you Killian, I'm so sorry to hear all the things you are going through with your brother, but violence creates even more violence, if you are really trying to get back into the Church then the way you act should be different to the way your brother acts, even if he drives you crazy.
I heard once that people who have been in the Church very active and then they leave, they become very hateful towards the things of the Gospel and Satan is possesing their bodies and minds and look at your brother, a return missionary ending up like a drunk man, and he is so young!, he is obviously in a state of misery, depression, and unhappiness....maybe your good influence, brotherly love can help him to stop doing some of the things he does...now, I know you are thinking: 'She has no clue how my brother really is and the things he says and does', you may be right....but I know that real love, the one that comes from the heart, the one that comes from feeling the compassion of God towards you, is the one that will save your brother's soul and life.
You see, the thread is 'when shall we defend', you did defend the Church but the point is how? Remember that the Spirit of contention comes from one and only source: Satan and he used both of you to accomplish his goal. I cannot imagine what could have happen if you pull the trigger of that firearm Now, please do not feel I'm judging you, I'm the least person to make a judgment being so hyper and easily irritated myself. Sometimes we feel we need to defend the Church as many times and as many occasions we need it but we need to be wise in how, where, when and who are the people involved. Just my two cents.