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Karbala stated QUOTE it is clear to me Israel - Page 2 - Studies of Islam - Posted: 28th Jul, 2007 - 5:41pm
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Islam: The Propaganda War - Page 2
Karbala:
| QUOTE |
| Why cant you understand. My religion HAS NO MEMBERSHIP. Islam is NOT A CLUB or an ORGANISATION. A muslim is simply one who testifies the Shahada (ie "I bear witness there is One God and Mohammad is his messenger). What I can say for sure is that these muslims are all going to hell |
Going back to semantics again? They are indeed Muslims as acknowledged by you...so how do you pretend me NOT to draw a connection between these Muslims groups and terrorism? You do not read the news? Don't you read this forum and the so many news concerning some terrorists being Muslims as well, kidnapping people and blowing themselves? Or are you saying that MOST of them are NOT Muslims. If you say that, then I won't bother to say anything anymore because it is obvious that you are in denial
| QUOTE |
| Do you think Islam/Quran is responsible or influenced what these people do? The Quran will never agree to what these people do. They will all burn in hell for their crimes. |
They are influenced by the Quran (you have Bin Laden as the perfect example quoting the Quran ) but they misinterpret its teachings.
| QUOTE |
| Please stop the madness. Its almost as if you are desparate to pin AL-Qaeda and the lot to Islam. Do you find muslims desparate to pin KKK or Christian Terrorist organisations to the religion of Christianity? |
Please, don't tell me what to do, nothing irritates me that much. It is not madness. I just do not understand why you want to deny a connection between some terrorists organizations and them being Muslims. The connection is there! They even quote from the Quran, mad or not mad, they are indeed part of Islam. But I am done with the topic, we will have to agree to disagree.
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War Propaganda Islam
The difference is that the these groups are marginilized by other Christians and jews. The proportion of individuals that support them are so miniscule that it is almost negligent.
In the islamic world the support for terror is prevalent,
consider
| QUOTE |
In a poll conducted by the Harry S. Truman Research Institute for the Advancement of Peace at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and the PCPSR found that 57% of Palestinian Arabs support terrorist attacks upon Israeli civilians, three-quarters of Palestinian Arabs support the kidnapping of Israeli soldiers in a bid to obtain the release of jailed Palestinians terrorists and 63% are inspired by the Lebanese Islamist terror group Hizballah and seek to emulate it. |
It would be hard for someone to tell me that this is not done in the name of Islam considering the sick, violent, teachings that are found in Mosques around the middle east.
Edited: dbackers on 17th Jul, 2007 - 2:07amPost Date: 17th Jul, 2007 - 9:03pm / Post ID: #
Islam: The Propaganda War Islam Studies
These people ARE muslims that is so obvious I cant believe we are arguing about it. I'm not in denial I know that there are bad muslims in the world. All I am saying to you is that these MUSLIMS do not represent Islam or have anything to do with the Quran just like certain CHRISTIANS (KKK) have nothing to do with Christianity or the Gospels. Which part of that do you disagree with?
You know what LDS_forever Ill go along with you. Islam has a connection with terrorism. But then you will have to admit that Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism etc all have a connection with terrorism. The bible has also influenced people to kill. Is this the sort of attitude you want to promote towards world religions? Will this sort of attitude bring peace?
I have a suggestion for a better more positive mindset. Stop blaming religions or communities of people for the actions of a few misguided people and unite against oppression and injustice. Muslims and Christians should be united against terrorism whether they be Al-Qaeda or George W Bush instead of trying to pin terrorists on each others religion.
| QUOTE |
| The difference is that the these groups are marginilized by other Christians and jews. The proportion of individuals that support them are so miniscule that it is almost negligent. |
Global terrorists like George W Bush and Ehud Olmert are marginalised by Jews and Christians? Are you American? Did you know your taxes support recognised terrorist groups such as Mujahideen Khalq in Iran? Did you know state terrorists like the State of Israel is entirely supported by your taxes? Do you call that "miniscule support?"
| QUOTE |
| In the islamic world the support for terror is prevalent, consider QUOTE In a poll conducted by the Harry S. Truman Research Institute for the Advancement of Peace at the Hebrew University of Jerusalem and the PCPSR found that 57% of Palestinian Arabs support terrorist attacks upon Israeli civilians, three-quarters of Palestinian Arabs support the kidnapping of Israeli soldiers in a bid to obtain the release of jailed Palestinians terrorists and 63% are inspired by the Lebanese Islamist terror group Hizballah and seek to emulate it. |
Hebrew University Jerusalem? Are you kidding me? This is a joke right? You expect them to be objective?
"Kidnapping" Israeli soldiers? Its funny how it is "kidnapping" when arabs do it but when Israel marches into Gaza it is "Arresting". The "Arrest" of israel soldiers is NOT terrorism. It is RESISTANCE, a right every palestinian and Lebanese arab is entitled to. I fully support them in that. Hizbollah FYI is a recognised political party in Lebanon with a legitamate resistance army under Lebanese law. You have no right to call them terrorists.
| QUOTE |
| It would be hard for someone to tell me that this is not done in the name of Islam considering the sick, violent, teachings that are found in Mosques around the middle east. |
Have you been to mosques in the middle east? If not then where did you get this little piece of information from?
Page 2 War Propaganda Islam
| QUOTE |
| Muslims and Christians should be united against terrorism whether they be Al-Qaeda or George W Bush instead of trying to pin terrorists on each others religion. |
I believe that we should be united against terrorism, but I do not believe this is a valid comparison.
Al-Qaedda has universally declared that they would kill every Jewish, American and western Citizen and has intentionally killed innocent civilians.
Goerge Bush has stated that his only goal is to fight those that would desire to kill innocents wether they be Muslim,Christian, or Jewish.
In Iraq Muslims are Killing Muslims
Hamas has stated
| QUOTE |
| Khaled Meshal, the chairman of Hamas political bureau, quoted by .'aretz online 5/3/06 said in a visit to Moscow: "We [Hamas] believe that Israel has no right to exist." 5/3/06 Khaled Meshal |
Concerning Hezbolah
From Boston.com world news titled Hezbollah is recruiting bombers to derail truce, Palestinians say
| QUOTE |
| We know that Hezbollah has been trying to recruit suicide bombers in the name of Al Aqsa Martyrs' Brigades to wage attacks that would sabotage the truce," an official said about an armed group of President Mahmoud Abbas's Fatah faction. |
I
f this is true then we have a right to call them terrorists
Hezbollah has already declared war on America .
| QUOTE |
| Hezbollah launched its war on Americans on April 18, 1983, with an attack on the U.S. Embassy in Beirut, which killed 17 Americans. During the 1980s, it was directly responsible for the deaths of at least 276 Americans. The most notorious item on its deadly tally sheet, of course, was the bombing of the Marine barracks, accounting for 87% of the total American deaths during the decade. |
From VFW Magazine, Oct, 2003 by Al Hemingway
Ok You may say, They killed Marines, that is War. Then America has Every right to Label Hezbollah as a terror organization, that is War.
| QUOTE |
| Hezbollah Leader Nasrallah: "Death To America." NASRALLAH: "Let the entire world hear me. Our hostility to the Great Satan is absolute. "¦ I conclude my speech with the slogan that will continue to reverberate on all occasions so that nobody will think that we have weakened. Regardless of how the world has changed after 11 September, Death to America will remain our reverberating and powerful slogan: Death to America." (Hezbollah Leader Nasrallah Supports Intifadah, Vows 'Death to America,' Aired On Beirut Al-Manar Television, 9/27/02) |
This man wants to kill me. I am an American and he wants my death. I will call Hezbollah a terrorist organization because they want me dead and I do need the U.S stated department's designation of Hezbollah as a terrorist organization to persuade me.
| Rather off topic, but... America may be at war with those that have declared war on America, but it is not America that is using suicide bombings every day to kill hundreds of Muslim civilians. It is Muslims that are killing Muslims. If America left now it would not make a difference. The Islam World has been at war with itself as much as it has been at war with the West |
Post Date: 19th Jul, 2007 - 9:27pm / Post ID: #
War Propaganda Islam
| QUOTE |
| Goerge Bush has stated that his only goal is to fight those that would desire to kill innocents wether they be Muslim,Christian, or Jewish. In Iraq Muslims are Killing Muslims |
George W Bush must be a saint if he says so.
George W Bush is a terrorist whichever way you choose to look at it.
Muslims are killing muslims in Iraq that is true. But who is responsible for the lawlessness and lack of security? May I ask was the Iraq war a legal war? Are the presence of US troops in the region justified given that there was no WMDs and no Ba'athi links to Al-Qaeda?
USA officially funds and backs the Israeli army which itself is responsible for numerous instances of state terrorism from Qana to Chatilla to Deir Yassin. Does this not make George W Bush a terrorist? I could go on and on.
"Israel has no right to exist". This is a statement I personally also believe in. Israel is an illegal, usurping and apartheid state. The zionist entity is by nature opposed to peace in the middle east. It has no right to exist. But do not translate this as a a threat of violence against innocents. Rather it is a call for an implementation of a one state solution where any zionist tendencies can be abolished completely.
Boston.com? your sources just get more and more reliable. between many in Palestine hate Hezbollah due to sectarian reasons. The quote you provided is very far-fetched for simple reasons. Hezbollah toes the Iranian line and this makes it very unlikely they would support Fatah in any way. They would be more likely to support Hamas. And what reason do they have to support factional violence in Palestine?
Beirut bombings? The perpatrators of this act has never ever ever been confirmed. Hezbollah has always denied any involvement. If you had been a bit more careful you would have realised that Hezbollah as an organisation was formed in 1985 while the marine attacks were carried out in 1983. Go figure.
| QUOTE |
| This man wants to kill me. I am an American and he wants my death. I will call Hezbollah a terrorist organization because they want me dead and I do need the U.S stated department's designation of Hezbollah as a terrorist organization to persuade me. |
"Death to America" is a popular slogan used throughout the Islamic world. It is a slogan of resistance to Imperialism and tyranny. This is not a threat of violence in anyway. Name me an incident involving Hezbollah on American soil? Anyway here is Nasrallah stance on innocent Americans.
| QUOTE |
| "It is unacceptable, it is forbidden, to harm the innocent," he told me, reflecting on Iraq. "To have Iraqis confronting the occupation army, this is natural. But if there are American tourists, or intellectuals, doctors, or professors who have nothing to do with this war, they are innocent, even though they are Americans, and it is forbidden. It is not acceptable to harm them." |
Islam: The Propaganda War
| QUOTE |
"Death to America" is a popular slogan used throughout the Islamic world |
Does this not show the mind set of Islam. I do not find "death to Pakistan" , "death to Bangladesh" being screamed in the streets of America or England. The Islamic world does not know how to live w
| QUOTE |
"Israel has no right to exist". This is a statement I personally also believe in. Israel is an illegal, usurping and apartheid state. The zionist entity is by nature opposed to peace in the middle east. It has no right to exist. But do not translate this as a a threat of violence against innocents. Rather it is a call for an implementation of a one state solution where any zionist tendencies can be abolished completely. |
Apartheid?
from the dictionary
Apartheid
A policy or practice of separating or segregating groups.
Every Islamic Nation is an apartheid state and by their natures separate and segregate groups. Shie hates Sunni and they kill each other every day, Jews and Christians are Margeilized and are Killed in many Islamic States. Religous liberty in the Islamic World is non-existent. You can actively read the Quaran in Israel, But the Bible is illegal in Saudi Arabia. Try Proselytizing The Christian religion or the Jewish religion in Sudan or Iran and you are in jeopardy of your life. Life as Israeli-Arab in Israel is much more tolerable then life as Jew or Christian in any Islamic (not Secular like Turkey) state.
I would ask you to provide reasons and documentation that Israel is an Illegal states rather then the usual rhetoric of Islamic extremists.
| Message Edited... LDS_forever: I just fixed your quote tags. |
Post Date: 27th Jul, 2007 - 7:57pm / Post ID: #
Islam Propaganda War - Page 2
| QUOTE |
| Apartheid? from the dictionary Apartheid A policy or practice of separating or segregating groups. |
Yes Apartheid exactly as you defined it in Israel.
| QUOTE |
| Every Islamic Nation is an apartheid state and by their natures separate and segregate groups. |
Really? Where in the Islamic world do you see an "Apartheid wall" which physically separates communities in the West Bank and Jerusalem. Where in the Islamic world do you see specific ethinics being segregated via military road blocks (as in West Bank). Where in the Islamic world do you see hundreds of thousands of religious or ethnic groups in refugee camps driven from their land? I could present numerous examples of daily living examples of apartheid for Arabs living in the Israeli state. If you really want to read about it here is a link to a Guardian Newspaper article. https://www.guardian.co.uk/israel/Story/0,,1703245,00.html
| QUOTE |
| I would ask you to provide reasons and documentation that Israel is an Illegal states rather then the usual rhetoric of Islamic extremists. |
Rhetoric of Islamic extremists? Kofi Annan would be most amused. He has been called alot of things but never an Islamic extremist!
| QUOTE |
| To the Israelis I say: You must end the illegal occupation. More urgently, you must stop the bombing of civilian areas, the assassinations, the unnecessary use of lethal force, the demolitions, and the daily humiliations of ordinary Palestinians, |
March 14, 2002 https://christianactionforisrael.org/un/kofi.html
Security Council resolution 242 (1967) states the inadmissablility to annex territory through war and orders Israel to withdraw.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nation...#Interpretation
Security Council resolution 242 (1967) states the inadmissablility to annex territory through war and orders Israel to withdraw.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nation...#Interpretation
| QUOTE |
| Withdrawal of Israeli armed forces from territories occupied in the recent conflict. |
I dont see Israel having gone back to its 1967 borders.
United Nations Security Council Resolution 478 declares Israels position on Jerusalem as illegal and actually calls upon member states to withdraw diplomatic missions from Jerusalem relocating to Tel Aviv.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nation..._Resolution_478
United Nations Security Council Resolution 478 declares Israels position on Jerusalem as illegal and actually calls upon member states to withdraw diplomatic missions from Jerusalem relocating to Tel Aviv.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Nation..._Resolution_478
| QUOTE |
| 1980 Knesset law (the "Jerusalem Law") declaring Jerusalem as Israel's "eternal and indivisible" capital was "null and void and must be rescinded forthwith". |
I wonder what you have to say about the following observation made in wikipedia
| QUOTE |
| The international perspective, excepting the U.S. in some cases, is that: The annexation of the Golan Heights and East Jerusalem are illegal and not recognized by international law The West Bank and Gaza are "occupied," because: They were captured by force of arms and against the will of their populations The residents in these areas were stateless Israel has put the territories under military rather than civilian administration, creating a de facto state of occupation Non-Jewish residents who reject Israeli citizenship and/or hegemony have the right to self-determination |
Islam Propaganda War Studies Islam - Page 2
Karbala stated
| QUOTE |
| it is clear to me Israel is an illegal state. |
and that has some merit but when we compare the present conflicts in the region, Israel wields the best propaganda due to the lack of unity amongst those in the region.
Israel comes out smelling like a rose especially when the Arab world refuses to take part to help a fellow nation! Even Iran is 2 faced on the matter but they have reason to defend their Iraqi Shi'a brethren who suffered under Sunni hegemony.
Someone once said an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth and we will end up blind and toothless
Edited: yeniseri on 28th Jul, 2007 - 5:42pm
Israel comes out smelling like a rose especially when the Arab world refuses to take part to help a fellow nation! Even Iran is 2 faced on the matter but they have reason to defend their Iraqi Shi'a brethren who suffered under Sunni hegemony.
Someone once said an eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth and we will end up blind and toothless
Edited: yeniseri on 28th Jul, 2007 - 5:42pm TOPIC: Islam: The Propaganda War